Spiritually Speaking With Liz

What's Going Gong?!

November 30, 2022 Liz Hill / Jules Cooper Episode 24
Spiritually Speaking With Liz
What's Going Gong?!
Show Notes Transcript

In this episode I talk to Jules Cooper of Dragonfly Yoga and Sound therapy.
Jules shares with us her enthusiasm about sound therapy and what drew her to it.
Jules talks openly about the loss of her 2year old little boy Finn and how she turned to yoga and then sound therapy to help her deal with the loss.

Grab a drink and join us
Love
Liz x

Jules can be contacted on :
Instagram: Julescoops13
Email: julescooperdragonfly@gmail.com
or to book a session: bookwhen.com/dragonflyyogaandsoundtherapy

We spoke about the Acorn Wellness retreat:
Instagram: acornretreat
Facebook: Acorn Wellness Retreat
Website: www.acronwellness.co.uk

You can contact me in on the following:
Instagram:  spiritually_speaking_222
Facebook:  Spirituallyspeaking222
Email: spirituallyspeaking222@gmail.com

Hi, this is Liz and welcome to my podcast, spiritually Speaking with Liz. In this episode, I'm joined by the fabulous Jules Cooper of Dragonfly Yoga and Sound Therapy. Jules is a British Wheel of yoga trained yoga therapist, a teacher for over 10 years now, and a pregnancy teacher too. She offers shamanic healing sessions, crystal workshops, as well as selling crystals, sound therapy sessions, all in the Harrogate and North Yorkshire areas.

So she's a multi-talented lady, and today I've got her on to talk about sound therapy. So Jules, thank you so much for joining. 

Thank you for asking me. I'm absolutely thrilled and delighted. A, to be able to work with you again after seeing you only at the weekend, which was lovely. And, uh, getting to talk about my passion or one of my passions.

Fabulous. So let's get straight going and tell me and everybody listening, what is sound 

therapy? So sound therapy is using different instruments to create sound, which creates vibration, which then moves through our physical body and our, um, our different energy bodies as well. So it's the, it's a whole healing package.

Yeah, that's in, that's in a nutshell. Yeah. . 

So do different instruments have different frequencies?  Before I met you, I used to live in Spain, as you know, and I used to go to a lot of, They were more called sound baths, and it was run by an amazing German couple, and they would take over a big yoga shala and all down the center. They had lots of different instruments. Lots of different instruments. You know, they were mambas, they were singing bowls. They didn't have a gong. They had the, I dunno what you call it, that lovely rain drum that you 

have. Oh, the ocean drum. Oh, close ocean drum. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 

Rains stick is what I was thinking of.

Yeah. Rains stick, ocean drum. Oh, right, okay. Yeah. And they had lots of other different, instruments that then they would sort of work through as, as they were doing it. And I've been to,  a couple here that use many instruments or quite a few instruments. So what is the benefit of using. Well, is there a benefit of using specific instruments?

Yeah, for sure. Yeah, for sure. There is. And you're right, there are so many. Um, and you can emit music from things what are not instruments. It's that, you know, it's that amazing. , , so for instance, with, so I have an ocean drum, which is, um, it's, it's obviously shaped like a drum. It's round and it's about so thick and inside it's got little ball bearings and it's got, um, a fake.

So it's, it's not an animal skin, it's like an artificial skin. So as you run, as you move the, um, ocean from side to side or around, or you can even, I tend to move my body with it. So I get the whole kind of feeling of, of what I'm doing. That makes the sound of the ocean. And so water is very much connected to our feelings.

It's our sacral center, our our center of of feeling. Mm-hmm. . And so I start my gong baths with that because I feel that it gets people straight away connected with their emotions and it's a good place to start. Um, and then I, I am a bit of a, a gong purist, I must admit. Um, I do have a couple of singing balls, but for me it's just, it's the gong. It, it's all about the gong.  So then I'll, I'll, I'll start with the, the actual gong bath, using the gongs, and then I finish with a rains stick. Or maybe like a little chime just to bring people gently back into the room fromtheir journey, 

 I must admit I can remember. Um, so I met Jules through the Acorn Wellness Retreat near Brimham Rocks in North Yorkshire, and.

I was, you know, everybody was raving about you. Said, you know, you must go. You must go. And when it was, when I heard it was just the gong, I was like, well, how's that gonna work? Because I've been used to many instruments and I, I get it now after the first time I came to you, you just had the one gong and the it, it's just something else to me because you build up, so you start with the ocean drum, like you say. So you, you're sort of letting go of your day, sinking into the mat, coming into the moment, coming into the room, and then the gong starts. So I, I don't mean to offend by my lack of explanation technically wise, but they. You. You just start gently with the gong and for me it feels like you go on a little bit, out a little bit in a little bit each time you're sort of like taking us deeper, coming back out, taking us deeper again, coming back out. And it builds to like this crescendo of. Sound and it's just all around you. It's not just coming I, because you are behind us, but it's not just coming from behind us.

At that point, I don't feel it's like you are within it, within the sound is that must be the frequency, is it? Of the sound bouncing off the walls maybe? 

Yeah, for sure. Yeah, definitely. 

So it takes you to that deep place and, and I call it my reset because it is like someone who's just pressed the button of reset and you're like, there we go.

Back in the room. So what, explain to me the, if I'm right with that, that's what it feels like for the participant, the building up and then the gently coming back down. So what does that do? How does that work within our bodies? 

So the frequency created by the, by the gongs. And my, my gongs are, one of them is uh, an earth gong.

So the. Earth is at the same frequency and hertz as the heart chakra. So it's a heart gone. So it very much works with, with the heart. Now the, the other one is, um, it's also a heart gone, but it's very different. So the, the earth gong is very kind of it. , I like to start with it because it's gentle and she kind of allows you to slowly find your place and just to settle.

Uh, and then when I feel that we've got to a point with her where it's almost like I'm ho I'm, it's not me. I dunno what it is, but , it's like I'm holding them in this pocket of space and you are not on the physical plane. And you are somewhere between the physical plane and the etheric, or the spiritual, however you look at it.

So she kind of holds you there. And then when I bring the other gong in, which is more, um, energetic, it's more like, It's there. It's, it's in the room. It's, it's, it's a bit louder as well. And then I bring that one in and I'll build the crescendo with that one. So you've been held here, then I'm building in the sound up with the other one.

Um, and it, it, it kind of allows this here to kind of sink back and then this can take over. It's really phenomen. It's quite difficult for me to explain in a way because, um, the, it's not conscious effort from me. It's not a conscious act. Mm-hmm.  it is. Um, it's very much, comes from my, from my spirit team.

100%. So I, I, and I say it a lot in my gong class, that was nothing really to do with me. I literally hold the mallets and, but I am out of body and they, so they, they're the ones who are doing the gong bath really. I'm just, I'm, I'm the puppet and they. You know, they're the orchestra. They really are. Yeah, that 

makes sense.

And it is different each time. 

Wholly different, wholly different. And I say that, um, before each gong bath, um, that everything is transient. So I am transient and you are transient as a student, the gongs are transient. The room, the energy in the room is transient. We're constantly moving. We're all in perpetual motion, so you can never have the same experience.

And I do explain that as well. So if somebody has, um, a really positive experience, um, you know, sometimes you can get really beautiful visions. Sometimes you can see, um, loved ones pass out who have passed on, um, where it's, when you're in that place where the worlds are closer and the, the veil is thinning, as we know right now, it's, it's thin thinning all the time.

And, and it. It really fills my heart when that happens that they were able to get to that point where they could, they were twi worlds or had one foot in one world and the other foot in this world. And I just find that absolutely beautiful and, um, really heartwarming. 

And I, and that'll tie in with your Shamanic training as well, won't it?

A Foot in each world 

100%. Yeah. Definitely. Definitely. I've, I've very much. I think I constantly work with the shamanic elements, um, and particularly when I'm drumming as well. For instance, when I'm drumming, I feel that it's, I'm in a different body. I feel like I'm in, I'm going, I feel like I've connected to a another life and I'm bringing it into this life.

Um, but yeah, it's, I feel all of my sound work is, has a strong shamanic, um, perspective. on it 

Ye,, I understand that. So what got you into the sound therapy? What got you into yoga and what got you into the sound therapy? 

Okay, so starting with, uh, yoga. So, um, I lost my little boy in 2002,  to a, um, a traumatic accident at home. , he, he took the screw outta the back of a chair and put in his mouth and he choked, he was two years old, um, and it was just the most catastrophic, um, Crumbs. I can't find enough words to to say it really, but it, it really was. It really was. It was the end of the world for us. You know? It was, it really was.

We've got, when we have three daughters who were older, he was, he was our youngest, Finn was our youngest, um, and. So we lost him on the Saturday and on the Tuesday I thought, oh, I'm just, I need to just, but at this point I had not been eating. Um, I had not been sleeping. I was numb. I just wasn't feeling anything. I was completely numb and I just wanted time to myself. So I went and had a bath and, um, And I dunno what happened. I didn't necessarily see, well, I didn't see anything. I didn't necessarily feel anything, but I think I did on a level where I wasn't aware of mm-hmm.  and I walked out of the bathroom, a different person, and I organized his funeral. I knew exactly what I wanted. I knew that, and this was the biggest shock for me because at that point I wasn't spiritual. I didn't. No, not that I wasn't spiritual, but I certainly wasn't aware of it. If I was spiritual, I wasn't aware of it. Mm-hmm. , so I wasn't in that game. Yeah. And, um, I, ,  I, I just dunno what happened. I organized this funeral, um, and I knew, or I was getting the message that I had to have him cremated. And they, and, and I think this was probably my first conscious awareness of my guides. They said, you need to have him cremated because the cords need to be cut so that he can fully move through because he would've wanted to be with us.

Wow. Okay. 

And, and that brings up so much, emotion just, just thinking of that and to, to think of having to cremate your child. Is bad enough, but, but that softened it for me because I knew that I was sending him a, we, we were sending him on his way fully because I didn't want him, I didn't want him not being able to, you know, to move on fully. Um, and, and that was, that was just, just phenomenal for me. And that was the start of my spiritual journey from that point. 

Yeah, that's, that's amazing. Such, obviously I know your story, knowing you, but I think that is such an inspiration to people who have lost a child, people going through a difficult time just to, to know that even in that, That must have been your absolute worst case scenario of, of any parent.

Nobody can even imagine what that must feel like. So that really was the dark night of the soul, wasn't it? That really was that point of it can't get any worse than this. 

No. Truly, truly it. No, it, no. And I know that there's, I won't go anything. I won't go through anything. Like that again, because that is the absolute.

The worst thing that can ever happen to a parent. Yeah. The worst thing that can ever. And I remember speaking to the vicar in our village who reached out to us, um, and he said, I can put you in contact with my friend. Um, and he, you know, it might be nice for you to talk to him. And I said, okay. And anyway, so I saw this guy, this guy had lost three children.

Three children, and we had an amazing. Conversation. And I said, how did you, how did you deal with that? And he said, well, you know, he said, we, we spoke, we all spoke as a family. We, we verbalized our grief. Um, And, and that was a real turning point for me in my life. And I took that from that conversation. I took that into our family and I said, look, we need to all have space to, to speak when, when we need to speak.

Yeah. What we need to speak. Um, and, and, and we did, and you know, myself and my husband, we had very different ways of grieving. Mm-hmm. , and this is another really important thing, thing I think for, for anybody who's listening, who has lost a child, that it's okay to grieve differently. My husband went down the route of guilt and he felt incredibly guilty.

And I went, I went down the road of, we could never have anticipated this. I had a sense that it was always gonna happen, not before it happened afterwards. I had a sense that this was in this, I had signed up for, I dunno how to say it. I'm trying to say it in a, I know what you mean. Yeah. I'd signed up to it before I was born.

He Finn signed up to it before he was born and we came together in the same family because I had to learn that that what it was like to lose a child and he had to learn what it was like to pass on as a young spirit. That is so powerful. I'm, um, yeah, yeah, yeah. And, and, and so there was so much that God bless him, his little life brought us, you know, he was only with us two years, but my Lord, he brought so much and left so much with us as well.

Yeah. That's 

amazing. So this is when you turn to yoga then as wellwith the awakening, 

so to speak. 

Yeah. So I had a really busy mind and I was struggling to um, quite to, to have control of my mind and I was having really traumatic flashbacks as well. Um, yeah. And, and so I thought, right, I'm gonna, I tried Pilates and it didn't do it for me cuz it, there was, there wasn't the, the aspect that I wanted, which was to be able to control my thoughts.

Um, and then how I started yoga. And sure enough, yoga pulled me out of a very dark hole. I, I was, I could see myself, I had a vision of myself at times, at the bottom of a really dark well, um, and yoga pulled it. Yoga taught me how to rise above the thoughts in my head and how to bring myself back to a central point where I could step back and be like, no, I don't have to go, I don't have. Have those thoughts in my head, I can control it. And that was the beginning of my love for yoga and my, um, teacher training, which I found about two years after I started yoga. 

It is an amazing practice, isn't it? You know? It is. It's all encompassing. It just covers everything. Such ancient texts. How can they be so relevant today? But they. 

It's so true. Yeah, absolutely. It, it's so true. And you, it, it changed my life. It completely changed my life, and it can change anybody's life. If you go into it with an open heart and, and you attend class regularly and you mark, the most important thing for me was finding a teacher and, and I was very lucky.

I found. Two or three teachers who I really resonated with. I found some teachers that I didn't as well and I walked away. Mm-hmm.  cause it just, I wasn't able to learn as much from them. But when you connect to your teacher on a heart level, um, it's, it's quite phenomenal. And, um, it's the beginning of an amazing journey.

Yeah, 

it is. I can vouch for that. I was really lucky that I was straight in and found mine straight away. But I have since been like, To classes. And as a very quick aside, I, a gorgeous lady who was one of my yoga students in Spain, she came in the shop yesterday and she was telling me about a yoga class that she's going to at the moment.

And she puts oils on, you know, the roller  ball oils on her wrist. And sometimes on her neck before she goes in and the teacher called her out. Who's, there's a smell in here. I don't like it. Who's wearing it? She's in the class. Oh my 

word. Yeah. And yeah, that's not, and it's not very yoga like, is it? It's very, it's definitely not very yoga. It's definitely not very yoga. I was horrified. Anyway. Sorry, slight aside there, . So then when did the sound therapy come? How did that find you? 

So, um, sound. So I was, uh, on a little holiday in Ibiza with some girlfriends and,  somebody mentioned to us that there was a, a sound bath on the island.

Um, and we just, we, we literally, it was in the middle of the island. We were on the coast, and, uh, we literally just managed to squeeze in. She, she lit. She wasn't gonna let it in, that the lady who was running the, the session and she said, oh, I could squeeze you in, but it's, you're gonna be really squashed in right at the back.

We were like, no, it doesn't. And, and that was my first gong bath. And, um, and I had no expectations. Uh, I think I'd learned that from losing Finn, that, you know, no expectations. And, um, I found as I relaxed, I found that I started to have visions and it was just like people's faces. So there was like ones I can remember, there was like an old guy with gray hair, like balding on the top there.

Another one was a squa, and these were just like, um, Rolodex pictures in my third eye just moving past. And I was like, Okay. I knew not to question it. I knew just to not get too involved in it cuz it would've went. So I just watched it, all these different faces and uh, I had a feeling that it was past lives.

My past lives, all of these different people. Um, cause I do feel that I, I felt before that, that I definitely had a connection to like a Native American past life. That was one of them. Um, And, uh, and that was just phenomenal. Came away feeling energized and calm at the same time. And she used a lot of different, she used,  a gong, but she had lots of other different sounds as well to kind of take you on a little journey.

It was really beautiful. Um, and then after that I waited a little while, maybe three years, um, just by accident. And I went to Bali with my yoga teacher, friend. And I've been told about this place called, , pyramids of Chi, and if anybody's listening and you're going to Bali, um, if you are in, um, or do, well, what's it called?

I can't remember now. I mean, I went there. Oh good. Thank you. Yeah, thank you. Thank you. Thank you. So if you're going to Ubud there's a free bus from Ubud the town center to to pyramids of chi it's about 20 minutes, and it literally was two pyramids. They had a sun pyramid and  a moon pyramid.

And um, in the middle they had,  the floor was like kind of. It was like lower than the, the level that we were on. Mm-hmm. . And the people, the people who were running it were stood in there and they had all sorts, like, didgeredoos, gongs, flutes, drums, guitars. They were singing, chanting, um, Indian text and.

That was amazing. And we were laid on a beautiful, comfortable bed that it was packed. By the way, there was probably about 150 people in here. Wow. Yeah, it was a little wow, how big's the pyramid!. It was a big pyramid. It was a big pyramid and, um, and I, I had a problem with my shoulder. I'd done something in yoga with my shoulder and all of a sudden, I mean, I was in a diff on a different level, complete. All of a sudden my arm lifted up. By itself or with help but not, there was nobody doing it for me. And my arm lifted up and it started to like really shake my arm. Wow. And I flooded, crying, like so much my, oh, I couldn't stop the tears. And at the end, one of the, there was, uh, one of the women, there was a woman and a man who were, who were doing this, the, the session.

And she came over to me. I was just sat quietly and she. That was re really powerful and I said, yeah, it was, um, I said, I dunno what it was, but my shoulder, I've got no pain in my shoulder. It's been really painful. And anyway, and I was still crying and she was just hugging me. It was really lovely. Um, and that really helped me to realize the power of sound.

That was, that was it for me. I was absolutely hooked. And then I came home and I kept on getting a message, buy a gong, buy a gong, buy a gong. And I'm like, what? Seriously? I got through out record a choir when I was in primary school. I was that bad, like, and you're asking me to buy a gong. Anyway, , that's what I did in 2016. I thought, well, you know what, if I don't like it, I'll just sell it  and I, and I found that I sat in front of it with my mallet and it just happened. And I was like, really? Had not, I'd had no training, no training at all. Well, at that point I hadn't. And to, to be fair, I've only done a little bit because I realized that it wasn't coming from me.

No, I was, I was a channel, I was a clear channel for, uh, my guides to, to work through me. And I realized that, and I thought, well, what's the point of me going to learn stuff on a physical level, like for my brain when if my brain's really got nothing to do with it? No, no, that's so, um, yeah, so that's really how I found sound and it's literally just blew me away. Um, the people who come who share with me sometimes what they have experienced, um, yeah, it's, it's blew my mind. It's just phenomen. I think I've said that word three times. Sorry, Liz. Yeah, it 

is, it is. With, so saying about what people have shared with you, can you, obviously, without giving names, but can you give a couple of examples?

So we've had your, um, with your shoulder and that movement of the arm. So that was like the clearing of the heart, wasn't it, that release? Yeah. So can you. Give examples so for me it feels like a reset. I just feel like I've shed my overcoat. I walk out of that space and just think I'm back. You know? I feel like I'm totally back in my body again when I've been stuck in my head.

So can you give examples of, of other people and what they've experienced? 

Yeah, for definite. Um, so I've had quite a few, um, people who have seen their seen animals and they're like, oh, I saw a whale, and without actually trying to plant anything in their brain. And it's really difficult cuz I know what's going on.

That's their, that's their power animal. And if you are, are not familiar with with that cuz that is very much a shamanic. Gather what you learn on the shaman path as well. So if they haven't worked shamanically, I've done any shaman work, they'll be thinking, oh, that's weird. I saw a whale, or I saw, I saw a frog, you know, and, and it's sometimes, and so I just say, you know, it could be, and I'm not sure, but it could be your power animal connecting with you and so then I would. Just doing a little bit of reading up about it, about that animal and about, um, the qualities that it has and seeing if that resonates with you in your life at the moment and what you are going through. Um, and I, I quite often say that you, we have many power animals who come in at different times for different needs.

So that's one thing that I've had, um, another. Like I mentioned before, seeing somebody who's passed over, feeling them very close as well. That's another thing you can, they can feel them really close. So obviously again, that veil, um, the, the veil is they're managed to get through the veil. I think somehow are, there's some kind of connection there or there's a meeting of birth me coming, you know, this way and meeting.

Um, I had, uh, yeah, there was, um, somebody came once who had lost a partner to, suicide and, um, yeah. And she couldn't find peace with it. She really struggled with it. Um, and he, he came to her in, in, when she was in the gong bath, and she, she, she could let it. Wow. He, he, he allowed her to let it go. Uh, I mean, that is very powerful and that's a, that is a rarity, I must admit.

That's, that's not something that I come across every day, but it just shows what. Can happen, what can occur? And I think for all of that to happen, the student has to be in the right space and in the right mindset to be totally open to what's going on and to surrender to the sound. And I do use that quite often as well to surrender to the sound.

Um, so that needs to be there. And also the room needs to be very clean. This is something that I absolutely love doing and that's creating and holding safe space for people, and particularly for women only because, um, I do work with women and, um, and I do, I do. You know, we we're very emotional, very emotional beings.

And yeah, to be able to, to create a space, what is really safe is important to me. So I think that's another important thing where the gong bath or the sound bath is, um, is happening. Um, and then I quite often, um, talk people in with a, I use a lovely, um, first by Rumi and it's called the Guest House. It's my favorite.

Me too. It is me too. And I think Liz, and maybe you'll agree with me, that it's, the words are perfect for. For explaining to people how we get different emotions, but it's talking about letting go, you know, you let go with each one and then, um, you can find more freedom. And I believe that's what the Rumi poem  was saying.

Absolutely. Let the emotions in, let them do what they've got to do, let them out. I've just sent that to a student this week, funnily enough. Brilliant. Yeah, it, it is powerful. And, and the thing as well is that I really like about the, the sound therapy and the gong for me. Um, With the sound, I'll call it the sound bath as opposed to gong bath.

I dunno whether I'm using the right terminology, but when I say sound bath, I mean many instrument. So for me, with the sound bath, because I've done shamanic training too, as you know, and, and so I'm very visual. So when those sounds start. I'm on a journey. I'm, I'm gone. But what I find, and, and I like that and this, this place for that, but what I find for the gong is I stay.

In me or around me, if that makes sense. So I've spoken to,  Beccy of Wild Ways and I've spoken to Sarah of Dare to Dance and they both hold women's group. So the dance group, obviously they're um, Sarah leads them up in a dance. They, they dance freely. There's no lights on, just fairy lights. They're free to express themselves.

Beccy sits in circle. They talk, um, they do crafting. They just do things together. And you offer the same but. In the way that people don't have to do anything. They just lay, and I, I love the, the surrender. They lie down on the mat, they surrender to you, to the space. They allow themselves to be held in that space, and then they allow to come in what needs to come in.

So it's another way of, it's not just for women, we're just talking about. You're running it at the moment, but it's another way of, of holding space for women. So there's, there's so many facets. The dance will move the physical.  With Beccy, it'll be more of the talking, so it's the expression and then the gongs.

Also the physical, it's also the expression. It's like a mix of everything together, isn't it? Another form of express. 

Yeah. Completely. Completely. And I think it is really important as well, um, to, um, to maybe learn or to look at how to quiet in your mind because the mind can be a huge obstacle in Go baths.

Yeah. Um, it can, it can, it can keep you focused on the physical and you can't sink law into the, into the places where this deep healing can occur. Yeah. It, it is 

hard, but I think that's how. The building up it, it's because to start up, you know, you, you are with the ocean drum and it's nice and because I love the ocean, so you're there, you're on a beach.

You just, so the mind's still going a little bit. And then I find, um, if I'm in a very good place, I'm into it quickly. If I'm not, it might take me a good 15, 20 minutes to release myself to surrender. Just to let go and allow and then that's when the magic happens, isn't it? But I think it's like most things in life, it's the mind that naughty monkey mind  being naughty, you know, that's screaming in the supermarket. That monkey that's squealing and wanting to run around the jungle, you know, it's just hard to bring it down sometimes. Isn't it? 

Yeah. It, yeah, it really is. It really is. But yoga can help with that. With the breath. Yeah. The breathing is amazing for calming the mind. Yeah. Just as focusing on the, in the inhale and the exhale.

Just, it's, it's as simple as that. It's not complicated. It's really easy. Um, and I do get men come to the gong baths, but not. Not really nowhere near as many as, as the women. Um, there's, you know, it's probably 95% women. And then we get the, somebody brings their husband sometimes, you know, like, come on, you try this, you've got, you've got busy life, you've got busy business.

Come and try it. Um, but yeah, it's, it, it, people do, people do appreciate it. And I think it's different after the, the first one's always quite strange because the night the. Creates sound, what you've never heard before. Yeah. You can't equate it to anything. No. And people of, people often say to me, well, you stood over there because the sound just moves through the room.

And they does, they, they either say, well, you stood over there or Did you press play ? I get that a lot. And I'm like, no, I've, I've got mallets and just, I make sure them what I. To create the sound. Um, yeah, how it works. Um, it is, it's really interesting. Really interesting. That's funny. I 

love that. And yeah, it's a shame.

Hopefully more men will come, but I think things like that are seen as a more of a, a female thing unless like you say they're introduced and then they think, oh, right, okay, then I'll, I'll, I'll try that. They try it, they enjoy it, and then, yeah, I think men miss out quite a bit. Really? 

Yeah. I, I think women are more open generally Yes. Well, yeah, the, that. Well, so, so we, we'll try, we'll try a lot of things just to say, oh, just to say we've, we've done it. Whereas I think men can sometimes hold back a little bit, particularly, they probably think, well, not probably, but possibly they think it's airy fairy, you know? Just a bit.

Just a bit. So a bit woo woo. But it's actually, it's been happening, you know, sound bath. The gongs, which is what I deal with. Obviously they've, it's been thousands of years. You know, they use them in ceremony to welcome in priests and priestesses or to send people through to the afterlife or for, for weddings.

Few, you know, people who passed over to help them to cross. So it's, this is, this is. Ancient science and my guide said to me, not so long back, this is 21st century healing. Mm. This is not a new thing. Mm-hmm. . It's not woo woo. This has been happening for thousands of years and we are just now connecting back in with that.

You know, it's took a long time. Yeah. Moving full circle. Yeah. Coming full circle. I mean, we all know how, how advanced the Egyptians were, you know? Um, we are still not there yet. No, we're still not. So, so it just shows how, how competent the gongs are. They've been, they've been used for, they've been doing this for thousands of.

They know what they're 

doing. They do. They do. Thank goodness. Yeah, 

absolutely. Well, listen, thank you so much for joining me. I've absolutely loved it. And thank you for sharing your wisdom.  I'll put in the show notes the details about Jules, where her sessions are, link you across to her Instagram page, her Facebook page, and then you can see where she is and how to book.

With  📍 her.  Jules, thank you so much for joining me. It's been an absolute pleasure and I look forward to seeing you 

again soon. Thank you so much, Liz. Take care. Lots of love. And you, bye bye.