In this episode I am joined by the fabulous Christopher J. Miller, an artist and author of the book The Spiritual Artist.
We had a really interesting chat about what it means to be a Spiritual Artist, Chris explains that we are ALL spiritual artists, which was news to me(and quite fascinating!)
We chat about being present, gratitude, being in the flow, manifesting and so much more!
Grab yourself a cuppa and get comfy as this was a great chat!
Love
Liz x
Chris can be contacted in the following ways:
The Spiritual Artist Podcast: Click here
Click here to follow me on YouTube.
Click here to follow me on Instagram.
Click here to follow me on Facebook.
Purchase his new book, The Spiritual Artist, on Amazon.
Scheduling coaching: www.spiritualartisttoday.com
You can contact me in the usual way:
email: spirituallyspeaking222@gmail.com
Instagram: spirituallyspeakingwithliz
Facebook: spirituallyspeakingwithliz
My shop website is https://www.karmaripon.co.uk
In this episode I am joined by the fabulous Christopher J. Miller, an artist and author of the book The Spiritual Artist.
We had a really interesting chat about what it means to be a Spiritual Artist, Chris explains that we are ALL spiritual artists, which was news to me(and quite fascinating!)
We chat about being present, gratitude, being in the flow, manifesting and so much more!
Grab yourself a cuppa and get comfy as this was a great chat!
Love
Liz x
Chris can be contacted in the following ways:
The Spiritual Artist Podcast: Click here
Click here to follow me on YouTube.
Click here to follow me on Instagram.
Click here to follow me on Facebook.
Purchase his new book, The Spiritual Artist, on Amazon.
Scheduling coaching: www.spiritualartisttoday.com
You can contact me in the usual way:
email: spirituallyspeaking222@gmail.com
Instagram: spirituallyspeakingwithliz
Facebook: spirituallyspeakingwithliz
My shop website is https://www.karmaripon.co.uk
Hi, this is Liz and welcome to my podcast, Spiritually Speaking with Liz. Today I've got another fabulous guest for you. I'm joined by Christopher J. Miller, to give him his full name. He is an artist, author, podcaster, speaker, and has spent the last 25 years examining the creative process and its relationship to spirituality. He is the producer of the Spiritual Artist Podcast and the author of the Spiritual Artist book. So Chris, thank you for joining us and welcome.
Christopher J Miller:Oh, welcome. Thank you for having me. I appreciate it.
Liz Hill:My absolute pleasure. I always like to know about people's story, their spiritual journey, where it all began for them. So take us right back to the beginning, wherever that might be, and let us know how you started.
Christopher J Miller:Um, you know, I think my spiritual journey started when I was born, but, uh, I, I think I've always been, um, the older I get, the more I realized that I think I'm an empath. And I, I'm very high sense and I sense people around me and the situation around me. And so my early years were, were a period of, um, almost getting, uh, burned in certain ways by, by religion and also by, uh, society. Cause, um, so my story started out, I was very creative as a child, very energetic. I was always one of those kids that said, people said, shh. Hold it down. Hold it down. It's still a thing that I react to. And so, so, um, when I was going to art school and I was very young and I was going to art school in Pittsburgh to a, to a, on a Saturday morning, they would pack all these kids and drive them down to Carnegie Mellon. And we would go and sit in this huge auditorium and take art classes. And it was, when I say a huge auditorium, it was like a three tiered high Professional symphony hall and the teacher would stand up on the stage and he would show us on an easel how to draw something. And we would sit there with a piece of board on our lap and we would sketch and we would draw what he was drawing. And, uh, one Saturday morning and I went with my brother and one Saturday morning, um, a girl behind me was a friend with, she taps on my shoulder and I turn around to say something to her and he's up on the stage and Mr. Fitzgerald, he goes, You! You have the audacity to talk while I teach? Get out. And he, he makes me stand up. And I was on the bottom floor. So all tears, all the balconies were looking at me. And I had to carry my, my sketchbook out into the hallway while the class continued. And, um, it was very traumatizing because after class people filed past me, you know, when they let out. And I sat there, it was like the walk of shame. And, um, I. I got into the car when my dad came to pick us up and I threw my pencil and paper in the back and I said, I'm not an artist and I will never be an artist. What's next. And so that, that began years of me denying any sort of creativity and going in always the opposite direction. Um, uh, ironic. Uh, I will tell you that I was hiring in my twenties at, at a place in Dallas. This is on the other side of the country. And I was interviewing a woman. And I told her that story and she goes. I was in that room. She goes, we felt for you. That was so horrible what he did. And when I realized that it wasn't just my perception, right, of how the world was, here's someone that I didn't even know in the balcony. And she saw it and it still scarred her,
Liz Hill:you know?
Christopher J Miller:So I think teachers have an incredible responsibility to take care of students. And so that was one thing. And then the second thing was, um, I realized that when I was very active in the church, I was raised Catholic. And when I realized I was gay and the priest started saying all these horrible things about me, I'm like, but wait a minute, I'm the guy that comes in and teaches second grade. And I paint the halls and I come in on the weekends and I sort candy for the Easter find and all those things. And how can I be evil just because I'm attracted to someone of the same sex. And so at that point I turned away from God, I said, God, and I put God in a box and threw it out and said, I don't need you. And so it wasn't until. In my twenties that I started realizing that there was a spiritual energy of power out there. And I had a roommate, um, that was reading Shaki Gawan. I don't know if you remember that there was a book called living in the light. And I came, I came home from a party one night and she's sitting on the couch, candles lit reading that book. And I said, well, what's that about? And she said, well, it's about God. And I just immediately went, ah, stop. I don't do the God word. And, and it was funny. She said, well, what if you call, call it something different? And I said, what do you mean, call it something different? She said, what if you, what if you just think of it as a different name other than God? And, and I said, well, isn't that kind of cheating? Isn't that cheating? It's still, and she said, no, it's not just think of it. So it wasn't, I slowly started substituting it. There's all sorts of words. Some Abraham Hicks says source. Some people say, you know, mother nature, and there's so many different religions. And so I started substituting another word for that power, but it wasn't until I started painting again. That I realized that when I'm in flow and we're, and I think everybody can relate to that, you were saying earlier that, that you're not an artist, but we all, we all are creators. We all create. And when you're in that flow and you're doing what you love there, I feel it. I feel this connection to a greater. And when I say greater, I don't mean like, like. A negative energy or a strong power. I mean, wider, broader, bigger, bigger energy that I can tap into. And it's a personal relationship and it, it comes through me.
Liz Hill:And so
Christopher J Miller:someone will say, where did that painting come from? And I'll go came from spirit, right? It came through me and it came through my, my lens, my lens of life, but it's still was something bigger. So that's a long story there, but, uh, that's where I came to be the spiritual artist. I started learning when I painted that I was connecting with something that was broader, bigger, um, more creative than me. And, um, I started realizing that I wanted to share that with others. Teach it.
Liz Hill:That was one of my questions because that was one of the things. So you call it. Instead of God, you call it,
Christopher J Miller:you know, what's funny, I, in my book, I, I use an underline. I let people use their own name. Um, and so it changes for me and I called it spirit for a while. I I'm actually now calling it creative intelligence.
Liz Hill:Yeah, I liked that when, when I read that and I thought I liked that and I liked the explanation that you came to it. And like you say, there are many gods. There are many. Um, deities or same thing, deities or mother earth, whatever people want to worship or pray to. It doesn't matter because it's all the same.
Christopher J Miller:Right. And you know, you'll get into, you can get into heavy discussions with people that insist it has to be called by this name. And I keep saying, this is, are you forgetting what we're talking about here? We're talking about a greater power. We're talking about an all that is a power that is in all things. Do you really think that power is stuck on a name? You know, Oh, you have to call me this exact name.
Liz Hill:It's true. Is it the headmaster? Is it the principal? Is it the governor? It doesn't matter. It all, it all equates the same. Yeah. I totally agree with that.
Christopher J Miller:And so I try to see that in other people. And so I think that's important for all of us. When someone uses a different name, you don't have to correct them or say you have to use my name. I just go, Oh yeah, yeah, I know what that is. And so if someone says, you know, I feel Jesus Christ flowing through me when I create, I go, yeah, yeah, I get that. And when someone else says, I feel Muhammad. Yeah, Buddha. Exactly. And I don't have to, um, I think I don't have to fight for a name because it's the energy.
Liz Hill:Yeah, it goes back to that ego of needing a label, doesn't it? Where it's label less.
Christopher J Miller:It is
Liz Hill:labelless. Because it's just all encompassing. So the other thing which we've just laughed about, but something that really piqued my interest with you because you know, I think spiritual artists, um, let me, I'm not an artist and I'm going to say, but in my head, I'm not an artist because in my box, an artist is a painter, a sculptor, somebody who creates. Art, shall we say, but then you, so you explain in your words, because when I heard this and I was like, Oh my God, I've never even thought about it like that. The way that you worded it.
Christopher J Miller:Yeah, well, I hope I have it right. But I think when I think that when we're a conscious creator, so when we're really mindful and present and we create something. And so I talk about this in my book, but I also share this with people. If you're baking a cake and you're really thinking about those seasonings and spice and how much you mix and you are totally present in the process. So it's about being present to what you're doing. You are an artist. You are a creator. And so, you know, when my, my son, I'm finding out he's 19 and it's very interesting. He's, um, he's loving to cook a little bit, but he has such a good instinct and he's tapping into something and he'll sit there and he'll pull a seasoning out of the closet that I have never used. You know, it came in one of those spice racks and he'll go, I put that in the eggs and I'm like, and he, so he's being a spiritual artist when he cooks. And, and so it, it doesn't matter what you're doing. And so if you have to use the word creator instead of spiritual, instead of artist, do it. But we are all, that's what I believe. I believe that's why we're here is we are to be individualized expressions of God. And each one of us has a unique gift that we bring the world. And it's, to me, it's a crime if you hide from that gift or you put it under a bushel, so to speak. Let it out because that spark of spirit, of creative intelligence is going to, it will automatically provide you with abundance. It will provide you with love, satisfaction, personal growth. And most importantly, it'll help you help others. You will invariably share and help others.
Liz Hill:If
Christopher J Miller:you're following that.
Liz Hill:Yeah. I totally agree. It's following your bliss, isn't it?
Christopher J Miller:Yeah. Following your bliss.
Liz Hill:And that, but when you said that and you, you, uh, I think it was one of your podcasts I was listening to and you were saying about how the business person. Is an artist because they've created a business and it, and I was like, Hmm, I never thought about it like that. I don't know why, but it's just something I never thought. So thank you for that, for bringing that in that we are all artists. We just seem to, or I was following that linear box of, of putting an artist in that box. Right of what they are. When it's just
Christopher J Miller:a name. It's a name, right? Yeah. And you know, when I teach a class to people, like I would say to you, embrace it. Embrace that you are an artist and what you make is beautiful and unique and special and conscious. And, and you are. You are. Mm-Hmm. I
Liz Hill:am
Christopher J Miller:I love it.
Liz Hill:So let me ask you a question, because you cover this a lot in your book, and you talk about this quite a bit, which is overcoming limiting beliefs. To enable people to become that true creator, to become that true artist. And then it made me think when you were telling your story of, of being the kid and being outed in the, in the art class. Is that, do you think that's one of the roots of your limiting beliefs?
Christopher J Miller:Oh yeah, I do, I do, I do think that, I think that anything that happens to us, the way we're raised, our parents, society, um, even our heritage, you know, like where, what part of the country we're raised in, what part of the world we're raised in, all that stuff comes into what you'd call your, uh, consciousness, your overall consciousness of life. And so I think we're, we, we are challenged. I don't know if I want to use the word challenged. I said, I think we can take the opportunity. To use those experiences to grow and sit. And so always sitting down and going, well, is it true? You know, is it true that this, I love this example because before I realized that names weren't important, someone would say, have a blessed day. You know, I'm in the, I'm in the Bible belt in America. And so someone was, and I'd be like, how dare you, how dare you thrust your religion on me? And then I started thinking, wait a minute, what is the spiritual truth? What is the consciousness behind this? This woman is just wishing me love. She's just saying, have a lovely day. And when I shifted that in my head, suddenly I found myself, like I can watch. a, a minister on TV, even a traditional conservative minister, and I can hear the words differently and, and see the acceptance. Of course, I don't, I never condone any sort of isolation or separatism or dualistic thoughts. Nobody is less than or separate from, from us, from everybody. We're all, we're all individualized expressions of spirit. But yeah, I, um, I love that taking that on, you know, and realizing that,
Liz Hill:thank you. It's very true. It's just somebody giving you the nicest compliment from their point of
Christopher J Miller:view. From
Liz Hill:their heart. And
Christopher J Miller:now, and now, and now I'll turn around and go, have a blessed day too. And I say that with all love, not, not in a sarcastic way, but, but you know, there are so many people and I was one of them. That was scarred, that I didn't, I couldn't even have a relationship with a greater power. And so I think I'm trying to help people, um, Oh, I will share this story about a belief system. So a good friend of mine is atheist. And, or he claims he's atheist and he read my book and, and he goes, Oh my gosh, I couldn't handle that God word. And I said, look, I didn't use the God, I didn't say God in that book. I said a greater power. I said, underline fill in your meaning. And he goes, well, I just, I have issues with that. And so I, he's also a lovely, uh, gardener. He loves plants and nature. And I took him out to his front yard and, and I pointed to the sky and there was a flock of geese flying over. And I said, Look at those geese. They're following a pattern of intelligence, of a creative intelligence, flying north, south. They know how to fly in a formation. They actually, which is so amazing about geese, they replace, the lead will replace. He'll stay in the front and then switch, she'll go to the front, and it goes back and forth. There is, and I said to him, don't you see that? Don't you see that there's an intelligence behind this? There is a, there is a thought that makes creativity. And I think that intelligence also follows the act of love because it's, love is an expansive word. It's a multiplication word, more of, and you know, he turned to me, he goes, okay, all right. I, I, okay, I can accept it. There is a greater power. And I said, thank you, you know, and, and it, but get rid of the word. Don't let the word block you. Just like my roommate told me 20 years ago, Chris, if the is blocking you, throw it out. Don't use it.
Liz Hill:Yeah, exactly. Change it.
Christopher J Miller:And the same thing with your beliefs. I love that question. We all, it never ends. We're like an onion. Right? We're constantly, we encounter a new belief and go, Oh, you know, I do have a block there still and, um, I need to work through that. I need to, you know, face it, walk through it.
Liz Hill:What kind of tools would you give to somebody who had a limiting belief?
Christopher J Miller:Um, with a limiting belief, I think first you have to just always be curious, right? You know, this, this word is kind of flaring up a little bit, uh, I think across the world, but there is something about curious because, um, it's just being in that place of open mindedness, right? So, first, you have to be open minded to the fact that you might have a limiting belief. And let's say this. I would say open the door that you always have, we all have limiting beliefs. We can't help it. I, I am a white male and I've lived a certain way in society and I can't help but look at the world from that. And so I have to always say, Hmm, maybe that's not true what I'm believing. So first thing is you have a little curiosity and be open minded to the fact that you're not perfect. I think, um, and this is the same, even with, uh, Racial issues. You know, we have a race issue. If someone says I'm not prejudiced, well, we're human, we're, we're all prejudiced, you know, we can't help it, but we have to face it and be curious about how to walk through it, you know? So curious and open minded to the fact that we're not perfect. We're never done. We're never done.
Liz Hill:No,
Christopher J Miller:we're never finished. That's, that's the joy of it. And the challenge of it all at the same time. Right. It's that duality, but we're always going through. So have, have a curiosity about it, examining it and then questioning it and saying, is this true? You know, that that's a Byron Katie, you know, she always says, is it
Liz Hill:true?
Christopher J Miller:Yeah. I love that. It's a great question. You know, you asked yourself, if someone comes up to you and says, well, you're, you're this way, you're a selfish, then you should go. Well, is that true? Am I selfish? And, and look at the situation. Did I act selfishly in that situation? And with curiosity, you're willing to go, you know, maybe, maybe I didn't mean it that way, but I can see how he perceived it that way, or she perceived it that way. So you'd be curious. And then you ask yourself, is it true? And then there's, there's so many different ways that you can work through a belief, whether it's, um, you know, an affirmation or just holding it lightly. Um, I found a book. Uh, I'm, uh, it's called, this is way written back in the thirties, um, by a man named, uh, Alexander. It's called the Alexander technique. And have you ever heard that it's for, it's for actors and stuff. Yeah. Some really brilliant information in there, but you have to hold it lightly. You know, if you push against something and so what he says, or he says a lot, but one of the things he says is you just, um, just hold it there. Don't push against it and just question. Could this be true if you push against it? You make it true, but then you just sit there. And so if you push away from it, it makes it stronger. You just have to sit there and go, Oh. And so his thing is once you realize it, you know, when you realize, once you recognize it, then every time it comes up, you just, in that situation, I wish I knew the word he said, but in this situation, you just stop a minute. That's all you have to do. If I normally say, well, you know, I don't like that politician, just stop, breathe, be present and see what happens. Because once you start recognizing it, if you just stay in presence, you tweak it, you start tweaking it. Does that make, I hope that made sense.
Liz Hill:Absolute sense. Presence is the answer. Yes. It's the, the, one of the hardest things to be constantly present and reminding yourself to be present, I find. And one of the things I love about Byron Katie, which is. Sort of what you're saying is about watching your narrative.
Christopher J Miller:Mm.
Liz Hill:So they, you've constantly got this narrator going on and what stories are you telling? What stories is it telling you and then the no stop be present. Okay. Let's be curious about that. Let's look at that Is that true? You know, it's yeah, it's quite powerful and and it is quite well an immense way of dealing with a limiting belief Because it just dilutes it and I loved what you said about hold it lightly because we, we grab onto them, don't we? We, it's my limiting belief.
Christopher J Miller:Like it's our ego.
Liz Hill:Yeah. Yeah. You know, to be proud of and, and the not, you know, this is what we're here to work through, but I like that. Hold it, hold it lightly. So it's just that lightly. Yeah. That way.
Christopher J Miller:Eckhart Tolle, I listen to him a lot too, I love him, and he talks about how our ego is positioning itself. So, you know, when you sit there and say, all people are like this, it's your ego justifying its existence. And so if you say, okay, ego, I like to use, I use the term little Chris, and I'll say, oh, little Chris is feeling jealous right now. And I separate, I hold myself lightly. I separate from myself and go, look how little Chris is jealous that that other artist just had an art show and it's been so successful. And so once I separate myself from that and say, little Chris can be kind of petty. Then I go, you know what though? I can hold it lightly and go, but isn't it great that this artist is successful when that means artists all are successful and we all can do that, you know, and you can move it. You can move it.
Liz Hill:It's yeah. It's fantastic. Have you read a newer?
Christopher J Miller:Yes. I, I, I've read all those books repetitively
Liz Hill:that, that was life changing for me. That was really. Um, it just blew everything up.
Christopher J Miller:It did. You know, I'm not a big, I'm not a big hero person, but if there's one truly, truly brilliant person in our lifetime, that's Eckhart Tolle. And if you listen to his long speeches, you know, he, he, he goes on and you have to follow him and you have to be present. Yeah. But boy, boy, is he smart and funny. Oh yeah. Yeah. Cause he's present.
Liz Hill:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly that. And yeah. He
Christopher J Miller:even, he even holds himself lightly. You know, he'll say something and he'll, he'll laugh at himself, which is just very charming and very wonderful. You know,
Liz Hill:on that lighter note, tell me, um, one of your podcasts, again, I was listening to it was the one before Thanksgiving and it was about gratitude. And again, I want you to say in your words, because I, it really resonated with me, but I loved, I loved what you said. It was just so simple, but so poignant about something that a word that's banded about all the time.
Christopher J Miller:Oh, well, I hope I, I, I, you know, it's so funny, a lot of these things come to me just by being present and, and so they're in the moment. Um, but, I truly believe that, that gratitude is, is a portal, portal to creativity and that when we're in a place of gratitude and in a place of love, that, that, that not, I want to share this. This greater power is always present. It couldn't be greater if it isn't everywhere in the, in, in the frames behind you, it's everywhere. But when we can practice being closer to it and receiving better from it. And so when we're in the state of gratitude, which is appreciation and love, those ideas just come to us. You know, I, I love to tell people your problems can be solved if you just practice your presence, your state. Get, get up, get away from the, the physical aspect, the manifestation. We all want to fix things by moving, you know, moving the box. But sometimes you don't have to take action at all. You go up into your consciousness. You practice gratitude, you practice love and the idea will come about how to handle that box or how to be creative with that box. Creativity comes out of presence and gratitude. So I'll share this with you. I don't know if I talked about it so much back, back then, but I think of it as I think of this wave of. energy. And in the middle, I use the color green. And that is when you are connected. Spirit is flowing. You're in a state of love. You're in a state of gratitude. And boy, if you just practice being in that wonderful place, it's not about doing, I want to share that with the listener. It's not about doing, it's about being, being suddenly those wonderful ideas. You know, I'll just sit here and ideal pop. Oh my gosh. You know what I should, I should look up that, that art image and use it. You know, it just comes now. On the other side of the scale, I put red over there and that is when we push too hard. So, and trust me, I come from a push too hard background. I have two type A parents. They were all, they're German. They're all about, you know, to do lists and time lists and make it happen and plan and strategy, you know, you're going to force that rock up the hill, right? And so, but when you're there, you can, yes, you can force the rock up the hill, but you're not truly tapping into that greater power as well as you can. So because you're pushing too hard. And so when you feel that way, if you're pushing too hard, you can almost feel it in your body, right? It's tension. It's your jaw clenches. So let that go. And you'll slide back down into green. Now, the other side of the scale, when we're not, we don't try hard enough when we're just, we don't, we're not conscious. We don't focus. We don't, we don't practice presence. We're just going through the motions where it's Brown down there. Okay. That's the state of depression. That's when you're laying in bed and you're just like, uh, I don't even want to get up. I, I, life is terrible. And that's victim. That's when you're a victim. That's when you just, I can't control anything. Things just happen to me. Life is bad. I'm born this way. And when you're that way, you just have to move yourself up through gratitude. And love into the middle realm. And that's what, that's kind of what the whole book is about. All these ways of get back into green, get back into green, you know, I'm thrilled that you, you read the book. That makes
Liz Hill:me feel good. I love that about the rule of medium, which is what you're saying there.
Christopher J Miller:Yes, it is. Oh, I love it. And that's exactly right. One of the chapters of my book that came to me, I was sitting there, you know, it's about being medium, isn't it? Not, not, you know, it's that old, um, What was it? Uh, uh, Oh, you know, Goldilocks and the three bears, right? Too hard, too soft, just right. You know, and they always say there's, there's lessons to be learned from myth and, and folk stories. That's the message there. You don't want to, you, you can't force, and I learned this by being creative in painting, but you can't force a painting. You can't. And when I force a painting and I share this with my artist friends, I literally have punched a hole through the canvas. I'm painting so hard and so getting so frustrated that I punch a hole. So you, it's about being medium, just staying in that state of play, right? You know, Abraham Hicks would say, just play with it, just play with it. And listening to that impulse, make the move and listen. And then if you don't hear something, if you don't hear a move, Walk away, just, you know, I'm done. I'm done. I'm done with that painting for today. I'll come back tomorrow. Don't, but I've spent so many years trying to for, Oh, but the painting has to be done by five o'clock because, because I said so.
Liz Hill:Yeah.
Christopher J Miller:Right.
Liz Hill:Yeah. It's false. It's coming out of the flow, isn't it? Not being in the medium. Yeah.
Christopher J Miller:In the medium. And so I realized, you know, I asked an artist the other day, I went and spoke to an art group and they said to me, um, how do you judge a, a painting that's successful? And I said, you know, what's funny, I don't judge the painting anymore. I judge the state I was in when I painted it. Did I stay? In that rule of medium, in love, in gratitude, the longest. Can I just stretch that out as long as possible? How long can I go through the day and stay there? Like, Oh, isn't that interesting? Oh, that's curious. Oh yeah. Right. That's the, that's how I judge a painting, you know, which is very different from judging the physical manifestation.
Liz Hill:Yeah. But that's, that's perfect because that's. What it's all about and, and to me with art, it's subjective. You, if you connect with that artist and you see that, that painting or whatever it would be, then you feel it and you, you're drawn to it. So it will be drip. You'll be drawn to that energy. Won't you? Of the person of how they were feeling when they were painting it. I've never thought about that before.
Christopher J Miller:Yeah, I do. I believe they do sense the state that you were in when you created the state of consciousness that you were in when you created. I interviewed a guy. Um, a really wonderful muralist, um, early on and he lives up in, um, Massachusetts and he talks about, you can always, and you can paint from any emotion, right? You can paint from sadness, anger, hurt, but he said, when you start tweaking it, You can choose to paint in love. Now I want to, I want listeners to hear this. I am not saying if you want to go in there, paint a dark painting, do it, feel it, let it, you can't stop emotion, feel it. But when you get more and more refined, you, you can start choosing. And he said this, I loved it. You can choose to paint and joy. You know, I don't want to now it's always a choice, but emotions sometimes come over us and we just paint, you know, what, what do you do that you consider, uh, creating creative? I mean, I know you're doing this podcast.
Liz Hill:Um, yeah, I suppose doing this, um, I am two shops, which are like mind, body, spirit shops, spiritual shops. So within those, and I think my creativity as well, it is communication with the communication with people.
Christopher J Miller:And so when you're like right now, when you're in presence, that just feels like. The greatest thing. Yeah,
Liz Hill:absolutely. Absolutely. I think when you connect with somebody and exactly that you're present, you're listening, then to me, that's the, that's the greatest gift on both sides. It's, I love it. And I think for a person being heard as well is, is a powerful, a powerful.
Christopher J Miller:Do you do consultations or, um, uh, in this, or any
Liz Hill:counseling coaching shop counter?
Christopher J Miller:Oh, really? And you just, and sell, and you sell different things like, um. Candles, things like that, uh, crystals,
Liz Hill:incense, um, yeah, all that kind of thing, as well as a clothing range, um, that we, we go to India a lot and that's, that's a big passion of ours is going there and creating new, new clothing and new items that we sell. So that, yeah, I suppose that's a big part of my creative because once I get there, then it's like, I become. On fire in a good way. I just, I just love it. It just lights me up. Drives me crazy as well. It's a nuts place. It's one of those places that you have to you. It's a really good way of teaching you to be in the flow. Because you arrive in Delhi and immediately you're hitting against the traffic's crazy. It's going the wrong way. There's too many people. They're not following the lanes. Oh my God. There's all this going on. You just have to go. You just have to let, I always just say, let go, let India. And then I love it. As soon as you, as soon as you do that, the crazy isn't so crazy because it's, it's how they are. You know, this taxi driver is, is taxis in perfect condition. It's not full of dents and bangs on it. So, you know, you think, well, he's a good driver, so I just trust him, trust in the process. And, and it's a really good teacher is India.
Christopher J Miller:Oh, wow. I love it. Yeah. And so you just, it's about like, what, it's about surrendering into it, right? Yeah. You just surrender to it.
Liz Hill:Yeah. And be, yeah, and, and you can't help but be present because there's so much going on you know, and it, and it's, it's bizarre. You know, you can't be walking, looking for materials through one of the main markets in Delhi. You turn a corner and, and you're in the middle of a procession. You know, it's, it's some festival of some deity and you're walking in the middle of it. Like, okay, it's just, it's just the most, yeah, yeah, yeah. So that's part of where my creativity sort of comes alive there as well. So
Christopher J Miller:it's the, it's the dealing with talking to people, communicating with people. And then also it sounds like you, you're a good at aligning your energy, right?
Liz Hill:Yeah, yeah. You, you have to not so good sometimes, but yeah, generally I worked, I was a physical therapist for many years and a yoga teacher, so I'm used to that working with people. So it's just sort of gone into a different way.
Christopher J Miller:That's why you would know about Alexander technique, right? Because it's about your body. And, um, that's where I'm kind of moving into more exploration about how you bring your body to creativity. And like you said, you can feel it, right? Like when you're in that cab, you can feel in your body. If you're going upstream, if you're in red or if you're just letting go, but there's people walking around, right?
Liz Hill:They're, they're just tense. All the time. Yeah. I mean, I just have been for the last couple of weeks cause we've just opened the second shop and so it's been quite full on and I went for a cranial sacral therapy on Monday and when I came out of that, I was just like, ah, the next day is such a light, light treatment, but the next day I felt like I'd been steamrolled and then I felt so tired because my body's relaxed. You know, it's, it's let go. I've just been like, Oh, let all this go. And then exactly, then you back in the flow against this, but it's, it's hard to get, not to get pulled into it sometimes when you're trying to meet deadlines and things aren't happening the way you want them to see you pushing that boulder and it's,
Christopher J Miller:you know, I, I think that I love that because it reminds me of the importance of we all do that and I do believe that if you let go. I love that. Say, you know, you've heard the saying, let go, let God, um, what it, what it means to me is that when you let it, when you just focus on you and on your energy and your state, all the problems will fall into place, whether they're there, either they'll fade away because they really weren't important to start with or they resolve it's, it's amazing, right? They resolve themselves. Yeah. And that's where I believe there is this intelligence, this creative intelligence that's orchestrating things. And even better yet, I have found that all my life I've wanted to tell this intelligence who I am, you know, like this is who I am. And suddenly I'm having to go, tell me who. Tell me who I am. Let just show me. And it is, it's saying, this is who you are. And I'm like, but, and I'll sit there and go, but nobody makes money doing that. Or it's not. And it's like, this is who you are. And, and so it's that listening to it. Right. And so like you talking to people and, and, and attracting those energy vibrations and all the right things to have in your store, it will all fall into place and people will love what you pick out and they'll buy and they'll come to your store. And now you're opening a second store, which shows you that you're I'm in there. I'm in green. You know, I'm just going with the flow. I'm angry.
Liz Hill:Yes.
Christopher J Miller:I just, I love that. And I think, you know, it's something that's for listeners to, to, to think about is let spirit tell you who you are. You know, we all, we all sit there and go, I know who I am. I have a very big sports car and a big house. Nah, listen, that's
Liz Hill:not.
Christopher J Miller:Always what you are.
Liz Hill:I can remember doing my yoga teacher training and one of the things that we, cause you have to study all the Bhagavad Gita and the Upanishads and all of that. And one of the practices was, uh, it was just a half hour meditation. You were just left on your own for half an hour and you just had to repeat, who am I? Who am I? Who am I? Then she said, just repeat it. And I'm like, repeat it until what? You know, we're all like, well, what will happen? Just repeat it. Yeah, but when do it? Just repeat it. And because the mind's trying to take over, but you, you just get to that place where You're nothing, but you're everything and, and it sounds really way out and really bizarre, but I can remember bursting into tears and I am the rain. I am the wind. I am everything. And it was so profound just to let go of Liz. Yeah. This overcoat of this and just. Little Liz. I would say Little Liz. I'm Lizzy now from now on. I like
Christopher J Miller:that. But it is amazing. You know, I, I, I could, that's probably where we align too, cause I do yoga and I do yin yoga and I love it. And um. I think that's, that's, I think I read Wayne Dwyer talking about that. There's a, uh, something from asking that question. Who am I? Who am I? Yeah.
Liz Hill:Yeah. It's a very powerful one. So here's a, here's a question, but how does judgment, judgment of me, judgment of you, how does that affect our creativity?
Christopher J Miller:Okay, that's the opposite of, of, um, gratitude. So gratitude, while gratitude aligns us better with spirit, judgment pushes us away from spirit. And so, and I learned that from painting because I would start painting and immediately when I started watching my thoughts, I would do a stroke and be, Oh, that stinks. And you know, mom was right. I can't be an artist. You can never in judgment, judgment. And it, it literally, I don't know if you can feel it. You probably can. You can feel it in your body. When you say those negative judgments, start listening to your body and you'll feel yourself tensing up, even if it's judging, like, why is that person driving so slow? Or, you know, why is this taxi cab taking that road? Right? So judgment pulls us away from that flow. And, and so when, when you judge a situation, we don't know, huh, this is coming to me. So we don't always know the whole picture. And when we judge, we have to be coming from the little eye. This stuff just coming to me. Right, we're coming from the little I because we're looking from the selfish little Chris. Well, that this traffic, but what if, what if the, the taxi's going slower because there's a big accident up ahead and you're going to miss it. But when you judge from the little, the little Liz, you're stopping that flow of trusting spirit. And so judgment is a, is, is a lack of trust in the whole process and it pulls you back. I hope I explained that well, but yeah.
Liz Hill:Yeah, no, you did. And I liked that and jumping back. One thing that you, because I really liked this and your gratitude, you gave a tip. To do, I'll give you, Oh,
Christopher J Miller:your hands. Yes. So I, I use my hands and if I'm feeling, you know, this works for, I would share this with the listeners. Uh, you can't, if you can't see me, I'm holding up my hands. I have 10 digits using your fingers to count off 10 points of gratitude. It's a great practice to do. Um, when I get up in the morning and we're all this way, sometimes emotions engulf us. It. It's what they do. And so a gentle way of not, not resisting it, but to just guide yourself is to start noticing things you appreciate. And so I use my fingers to count off 10 items and I'll, and it can be as simple as, It can be as simple as, um, this is a great cup of coffee. You know, I'm glad I can sit here for five minutes before I go to work. You know, um, look at, look at that bird outside the window at the feeder. Isn't that an amazing bird, but I will share this with the listeners. They have to be come easy, come easy. It has to be light, light, light. Gratitude. You can't sit there and go, I'm glad the world is, is a great place if you're not feeling it, because that's pushing against, you know, like if you try to jump too far, but you can sit there and go, well, you know, this is nice that I have this time to do gratitude. I, aren't I glad that I learned. And you'll see that when you go through all 10, sometimes you can do more. But 10 is a good number for, for shifting yourself from, from being outside to inside that flow of, of creativity, reaching creative intelligence, appreciating it. Yeah. Thank you for reminding me that.
Liz Hill:And that pushing is, I think that's really powerful. In disarming when people are manifesting, because you, you hear people saying, you know, so on a morning I do my gratitude and they're grateful for what isn't here yet, but they're acting as if it is here. Does that make sense? So I'm, I'm grateful for my 20 stores nationwide, even though they're not here yet, but they, they, because it's just, it's too far.
Christopher J Miller:Yeah.
Liz Hill:The feeling isn't there. So there's a resistance. And it stops the flow, doesn't it? It stops, stops the gratitude because then you start to push and nothing's going to manifest if you're pushing and not feeling it.
Christopher J Miller:Right. It's it, you're noticing lack. So when you sit there and say, I see my 20 stores, you're, you're, you're looking at things that really aren't there. It's you're noticing lack. You know, they always say, you know, you call law of attraction. You have to be the thing. Not say it, you have to genuinely be in a state, a state of abundance. And when you do gratitude, you are in a state of abundance. You're saying, Oh, how wonderful that we're having this conversation. And I'm thinking, gosh, Liz, I need to have you on my podcast. Cause I like your energy and see that those things come naturally. Right? So you just have to come with things that come easy. Like you said, just natural, but things that you have. And when I realized, Oh, I have this, look at this. I'm meeting neat people and, and I'm sitting here and it's, and it's not Storming right now and there's no thunder, you know, all of a sudden I feel abundant with what I have.
Liz Hill:Yeah. And, and what I just said, I just want to clarify that's not going against, um, people manifesting and there are ways of doing that, that, you know, I'm, I'm pleased door number three is on its way or that kind of thing. There's, there's a part to that, but then there's pushing too far of expecting 20 by December. If that makes sense.
Christopher J Miller:Oh, I love this. I love what you just said. So what I would say it is, is it's okay to set an intention. That's what creators do. Yeah. Yeah. You set an intention and say, my intention is to have 20 stores. My intention is to be, uh, cash free and flowing. That's okay to set an intention, but you don't hold the intention. You claim it and you, you claim it and you, I, I say, you, you, you know, you, you can do a, a, a prayer to it, and then you let it go and trust that spirit will bring it to you. But if you sit there and go over and over again, my, I'm gonna have 20 stores. I wanna have 20 stores you're pushing against. But if you say, I, I want 20 stores. I want 20 stores, and you're in that state of play, I want 20 stores by year end. Put it and you can, and when I say, you can say it first thing in the morning if you want, you know, I'll tape it to your mirror. I have done that just to remind myself. But if I find myself pushing and pushing and, and, and. It's once again, it's noticing the lack, you know? So yes, intention, you know, so funny Liz, when I started painting, I had a problem with, um, intention. I thought, well, God's spirit's going to tell me what it wants. I don't need to tell God and we are co creating with spirit. And when, when I say that co creating means we're allowed to say, you know what? I would like a healthier body. My intention is that this disease is gone. And then we give it to God to help manifest it to manifest it. I would say, and it's co creating dance. It's a co creating dance. So, but when I first started, I was like, no, no, no. And so I had a, one of my mentors would say, no, Chris, you're allowed to ask. You're allowed to say, I want to sell a painting or I want to, you know, or set that intention first. You just don't hold it.
Liz Hill:Definitely. Now, what would you say are, uh, let's say three things. Well, no, it can be limitless of Chris's daily self care. What are your, your non negotiables? I like to do this daily.
Christopher J Miller:Okay. So non negotiable means it's, it's, it's my intent, but sometimes it doesn't happen, but get a good night's sleep. Yeah. You know, it's, it's so funny, um, and it's before the day starts, but I have found that going to bed at a decent hour the night before, taking some downtime, I read, I read the last hour, turning off the electrical things, um, that is one, so turning off the phone, looking at internet, all, reading the news, and just reading a book, and it's, and, and, or something pleasant. Before I go to bed. So getting a good night's sleep. The second thing is when I get up first thing in the morning is I, I do what I call a spiritual practice. And so I think if you're listening to this and you go, do I have a spiritual practice, you should, because you probably have an exercise practice and you might have, you know, a work practice, but spiritual practice is important. So for me, I'll sit down and I'll read something inspiring. Whether it's, uh, uh, Pima Children, are you familiar with her? I love her book. I'll read just a page or two and then I meditate on it. So I do that. So a good night's sleep, read something inspiring and meditate on it. And then I do what I call, um, meditate on the space around me. I know that this is going to sound weird, but I, I started to feel the presence of spirit around me. So even as I say this, if you feel the silence, there's a presence there and I connect with it and I recognize it and I show gratitude towards it and I say, Oh wow, I feel it. I feel it in the light above me that just came. Um, I'm just blinked in the air conditioner coming on and the, and the bird outside the window. And I start noticing spirit all around me. Those three.
Liz Hill:Because it is. That's beautiful. Yeah. That was, I always like to know people's practice because we all do something because we all want to feel that connection, don't we. And so I think it's important in whatever way you do it. It's all personal to us, but I, I think it's, um, It's important. And I like to, I like to hear people's what people do.
Christopher J Miller:Well, you know, I, I took some training in how to be a spiritual coach and went before when we sit with someone to do prayer, it's about sitting and feeling the presence and tapping into that presence. And it's just what you do when you go into the art studio or when you go paint, you align yourself with that presence first, and then you pick up the brush, you know, then you pick up the brush. And so it is wonderful, right? But I spent most of my life. Most of my life, I would just tumble out of bed and I'd have my to do list that was given to me by my type A parents or whatever. And I, I have to do, I have to do, I have to do, I have to make it happen. And now I've learned to say, no, I, I need to know the intent, hold my intent and then trust the Spirit's going to make it happen.
Liz Hill:That's amazing to, to have turned that around from such strong conditioning.
Christopher J Miller:Yeah. And it's still
Liz Hill:there.
Christopher J Miller:You know, like we said, every day you peel another layer off of that, that conditioning, right? Right. Yeah. Getting down to, like you said, I love how you said, just getting to be who you are minus the little, little Chris, little Kay, little Liz, whatever, you know, just who am I, you know?
Liz Hill:What three tips would you give to say 20, 20 ish year old Chris from you now?
Christopher J Miller:Oh, you know, I don't know if I can answer that because everything that happened to me Whether good or bad has made me who I am today. And so I wouldn't want to give myself any change because, you know, when I walked away from art. It made art so much more important when I rediscovered it. And when I walked away from God, it did the same thing. It made this relationship such a wonderful finding. So if I went back in time and said, Oh, don't get bothered that that guy shamed you, um, everything would be different. And, and, and I would, I would share this too. Even things like disease or issues that I've had made me so much more compassionate toward other people. And so when someone comes to me and says, Oh, I have an eating problem. I feel empathy for them. And so all those things that were challenging for me, make me reach out and say, wow, life is, it's hard. There's no question. Life, I'm not going to sugarcoat it and say life is easy. It's not, right? Every day we're going through something and we're going, that's hard. It's hard. And so when I can be with people that, that share that and we can be empathetic with each other and support each other and create a community of love, that's, that's all that matters. And, and, uh, and I have empathy for all over the world, you know, like I look out and see what's going on. And I, I just send that empathy out every day, send a little love to all these people that need food and, and that are being attacked in, in war zones and, uh, right. So just feel that love for them.
Liz Hill:Yeah. That's lovely. And with our own, like we've said, if the problem's there, it's there if we're happy, it's there if we're tense.
Christopher J Miller:It's there
Liz Hill:if we're grateful, it's there if we're in fear. So it's us, isn't it? Learning to, to be in that medium where we're in the green and we're staying in that presence and being curious. I mean, obviously I'm not talking about people's health, serious health conditions. I totally, I'm not being trite about that, but it is that choice of in day to day things while this situation is happening. Anyway, so I can either be really tense about it, or I can just try relax and be present about it. And make it go with the flow a little bit more.
Christopher J Miller:Yeah. And I think that does, that's the kind of the whole principle behind, um, why I do what I do is I, I don't know if I have the capability to be a president or a governor or anything that, but I do know that I can affect the people around me. And that if I can help people around me be more self aware of who they are, more reflective, more present, then, then that will spread. And if they tell, you know, it's that old, I don't remember that old commercial. It was a shampoo commercial. I tell 10, I told one friend and they told one friend and, and they show it exponentially. I don't know if they had it in the UK, but, um, you know, and so on and so forth. You know, if you affect, so I love that it's called the, I call this the rule of one. If you go out today and you help one person. And then they go out and help one person, the numbers expend exponentially, just go crazy. So every day, the goal is to just reach one person. So
Liz Hill:I totally, totally agree with that. And I think the, I don't watch the news and I get a lot of stick from people saying, I put my head in the sand. And I think if I need to hear something, somebody will tell me, which generally is what happens. But I think if The best, I can't do anything to change that. Unfortunately, I wish I could, I can't, it's God's business in the three businesses, yours, mine's God's. That's God's.
Christopher J Miller:We
Liz Hill:can't do anything about that. You know, me here, you there in Dallas, we, we can't change that situation, but what we can have any control of controls, wrong word, but is in our environment, so exactly that, that rule of one. That being a good person, helping other people, and then hopefully that it creates the ripple effect, like you're saying, that it goes out and then everybody, so hopefully we just spread a little love wherever we go, and that ripples through.
Christopher J Miller:Yeah, exactly. I love that phrase, what is mine to do? That's all you can figure out, and that's why I teach people, what is mine to do? Find out what is totally unique about you, because that is a gift. A true gift there is, you'll never meet anybody exactly like you again. There will never be another Liz on this planet, and so finding what is unique about you and just expressing it, even if it's one person at a time, that that, that it, it's powerful. It's very powerful.
Liz Hill:It is very powerful and it's taken me a long time to get to. I have to say through the fear of being seen, fear of what other people will think that it is, isn't it? Yeah, I have that one. Yes,
Christopher J Miller:I have that one too. So, yeah, I understand, but you know what? If you're just, if present, you go back and go, well, should I be afraid of this? And you can analyze it, right? We go back to loop back to the belief system. You can say, is this true that I should be afraid to be seen? Hmm. Does it matter what that one person says?
Liz Hill:Hmm.
Christopher J Miller:You know? So, yeah, I love it.
Liz Hill:Oh, Chris, I love you. I think this is fabulous. I've really enjoyed our chat and I would encourage everybody to get the book, have a read of that. I'll put all the details in the show notes. Chris has got podcasts. You're on you, um, Instagram, Facebook, all that. I'll put it all in the show notes. Check him out. You're doing, um, retreats. Aren't you doing an artist retreat?
Christopher J Miller:Yeah. I next in two, 10 days, I take 15 artists up to a lake and we paint and we do spiritual Um, and then I have one in the fall and then I have one in Santa Fe in the spring of 2025. So, yeah,
Liz Hill:I'd love to go to Santa Fe, I think you should come
Christopher J Miller:it's designed to, and it's totally, it's designed so anybody can do it. It's not like only someone that's been painting for 20 years. No, I, I designed it so that you're learning basic creative principles and if you are more experienced, you can run with it or you learn, but it's all about learning consciously. Yeah. Absolutely. Like learning on the spiritual level, how you can paint, how you can be creative. I love this. Thank you.
Liz Hill:Thank you so much for joining me guys. I'm going to be having a little break now, but I'll be back again very soon with some more fabulous guests. So come back and join me then. Bye.